Yeah - everything you say makes total sense and is the only
thing that has ever made sense about who gets charged for what
with ADSL lines (the Telecom ones in NZ that is - nothing to do
with the technicalities of ADSL itself but with the NZ Telecom
implementation of it).

You did not address the question of who pays what and to whom
if someone who has a full speed JetStream logon with and ISP and
logs on using another person's rate limited ADSL line with another
ISP.

One person has an account which charges based on the physical line
(which they are not using). The other person has a line which is rate
limited but data is free as they pay the ISP based on data used (which
they are not using).

The only logical answer is that no one pays (other than the base charges
for the actual service/line).

I have just read SPs reply and he mentions that this is how it works and
is a loophole and that we can do it if we do it only occasionally but if we
do it all the time then Telecom will clamp down on it. That sounds like
TOTAL CRAP to me. I may have a need to have logon with my work
logon when I am at home and should not have to get two ADSL lines
here just so Telecom can charge for both. The only reasonable way to
charge is to do it on the line OR the logon for all services or come up
with a solution which does not make unnecessary restrictions on people
and how they use their lines. I am not talking about people who want
to get more for less but about people who want to use the work login
at home or their home login at work and would like to feel comfortable
about the charging models used.

Chrissy.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne Kampjes" <Wayne.Kampjes@telecom.co.nz>
To: "ADSL" <adsl@lists.unixathome.org>
Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2003 1:16 AM
Subject: RE: ADSL, who pays?

> There is confusion here because there are 2 things happening
> - Telecom track and charge Jetstream traffic based on the DSL port (physical) you are on
> - ISP's don't really know the port so charge on login (for Jetstart)
>
> So, for the Jetstream/ Jetstart bit you are generally governed by the port you are on irrespective of the Login. This comment is
tempered a little by a few ISP's that limit you to loging in with a Jetstart account only from Jetstart ports (and Jetstream from
Jetstream lines).
>
> So
> - if you have a jetstart port (line) from Telecom you will get Rate Limited irrespective of the ISP login (Jetstreamgames
excepted)
> - if you have a jetstream port from Telecom you will get full speed irrespective of the ISP login
> - If you have a ISP Jetstart login you will still get charged or capped by the ISP even if you use a full-rate port.
> - if you have a Jetstream line and use another persons login the data still counts on your line usage!
>
> WRT to terms and conditions I would have thought that for a Jetstream LINE you would expect to pay irrespective of who used the
LINE (who said that it was only your traffic that would get charged on the LINE). And if you use your ISP Jetstart account you would
expect to pay where-ever you logged in (who said it was restricted to a particular line?).
>
> Cheers
> Wayne
>
> Disclaimer
> These are my opinions only and do not reflect the view of my employer
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Chrissy [mailto:ChrissyR@home.gen.nz]
> Sent: Saturday, 18 October 2003 00:34
> To: ADSL
> Subject: Re: ADSL, who pays?
>
>
> So if I was to go to my work and logon on using my
> JetStart login and download Gigs then I would pay
> and they would pay - there is a flaw in that.
>
> I actually suggested this once and was told that I was wrong.
> It was the only logical thing to happens if what people claimed
> to be true about how the system worked were true.
>
> Xtra have just confirmed that this does actually happen from
> a billing perspective.
>
>
> Which begs the question "what happens to someone with a
> full speed JetStream account who comes to my place and logs
> on to my rate limited ADSL line? They have not logged on to
> my ISP account so I don't pay. They have not logged on over
> their line so they do not pay. Ok - they a get rate limited account
> but at 128kb/s that is over 40 Gigs a month and no one pays.
>
> It is a LONG time since I read the terms and conditions of my
> account but I do not recall anything about where I can use the
> account or who I am allowed to allow to use my hardware with
> their logon.
>
> Chrissy.
>
>
>
> > If you're on jetstart, data charges are measured on your login. All
> > other jetstream plans are measured against your phone line. So if you
> > were to login with your jetstart username on someone's full speed
> > jetstream line, you'd both get charged for the data!
> >
>
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